Episode 41

Adventures in Expatting

In this episode, Erika Audrey sits down with Shari Margolin, author of The Young Expat’s Guide to Mexico, to talk about Shari’s whirlwind year of traveling the globe and her decision to settle down in Mexico. They dive into her personal stories, what it’s really like to live abroad, and practical tips for anyone considering a move. From cultural insights to unexpected adventures, it’s an honest, inspiring look at embracing life outside the usual borders.

Buy The Young Expat’s Guide to Mexico here

Shop Hawkins & Clover here

Book a trip with Shari by emailing her at shari@ciaobambino.com

Transcript
Erika:

welcome to Clover Club, a podcast about curious conversations and stories

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intended to make you laugh and learn.

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I'm your host, Erica, and today I'm

so thrilled to be joined by Sherry

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Margolin, co-author of the Young

Expats Guide to Mexico, Sherry.

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Hello.

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Shari: You for having

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Erika: Oh my gosh.

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Thank you so much for the time.

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, so you are joining us from

Mexico now and two hours behind.

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Shari: Yes, currently, but

we don't do daylight savings

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time anymore, so it switches.

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Erika: Oh, cool.

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Do you like it?

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, Shari: I, you know,

that's a good question.

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It's confusing because half the year

we're one hour behind the east coast and

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half the year we're two hours behind, so

it gets very complicated for scheduling

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things around the, the switching

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Erika: Yeah, this is like, I'm somebody

who has strong opinions about everything

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and the, the like decision to maybe

remove daylight savings time is one

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where I'm like, I dunno, like half of

me thinks it'd be great and the other

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half thinks it might be annoying.

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So this is interesting.

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Shari: Yeah.

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Erika: Okay.

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Shari: Yes,

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Erika: Scheduling nightmare.

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, so a little backstory

for people listening.

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I've known Sherry for like a

really long time, like 15, 20

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years, like a really long time.

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So I met Sherry as a client

forever ago when her and her

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husband Josh, lived in Atlanta.

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And then you guys.

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Came up with a plan to do something

really cool and then in the execution of

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that plan, your lives totally changed.

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And that is the story and the

information that I wanna share with

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everybody listening to this episode.

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'cause I think it's very relevant to

the times and just so, so, so cool.

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So I just wanna kind of start from the

very beginning if you'll share with

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everybody what this initial big plan was.

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Shari: Absolutely.

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We, yeah, we were just kind of

living, , a normal life in Atlanta.

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We lived in the east side.

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We were working, we both happened to

work for ourselves and worked from home.

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, and we were working a

lot, like a lot, a lot.

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And we were sort of having

kind of, I don't know, keeping

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up with the Joneses, right?

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Like we were doing okay, but we

felt like we were always chasing,

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you know, more money, , advancing

in our careers, things like that.

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And we both got super burnt out on it.

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And.

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Sort of had a really good, or probably

several good conversations, , and decided

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we needed to take a break and we thought,

let's just take a sabbatical, , and

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move out of the country for a year.

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Let's go somewhere else.

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And that was the plan.

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And so sort of started really

investigating that, researching, trying

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to decide where we were gonna move to.

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And we bought a giant map

and put it up on the wall.

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And we basically just started putting

pins in places that we were interested

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in moving to doing a little bit of

research on each of those places, and

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realized very quickly that there was so

many places that we were interested in

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going that we could not pick just one.

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fast forward a few more

good conversations, and we

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decided to travel for a year.

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So we've spent a year doing

a, a round the world trip.

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Erika: That is so cool and I already

have learned something new because

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in my mind, I don't know why, but I

remembered it as you guys thinking,

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let's take a year off and travel and,

but I didn't realize that the intention

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from the beginning was thinking that

you did want to be expats, so that's

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Shari: Well, not really expats.

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We, I mean, temporary expats, I guess.

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We

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Erika: okay.

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Shari: just live somewhere else for a

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Erika: Oh, I see.

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Shari: come back

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Erika: Okay.

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Okay.

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Okay.

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Shari: and,

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Erika: I see.

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Shari: it changed.

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Erika: Okay.

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So, uh, did you have a place in mind

where you were like, I'm sure it's

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gonna be Portugal or like, whatever,

or were you, you and Josh equally

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like, kind of all over the place?

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Shari: I think we each had about

five or six different places that we

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thought, oh, this could be a great

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Erika: Yeah.

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Shari: and none of them overlapped.

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, but not that either one of

us opposed any of those.

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It was just, there was so many options

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Erika: Yeah,

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Shari: the world's a big place

and we wanted to see a lot of

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Erika: yeah.

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So, okay.

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Walk me through the timeline between these

initial conversations and, uh, how long

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it took to kind of get your ducks in a

row and get everything ready to really

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implement this, and then , from then to

the day you boarded your first flight.

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Shari: Okay, so I think this, we initially

started having these conversations

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in, I'm gonna say maybe 2015.

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Erika: Okay.

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, Shari: and we had, , I know that you

will relate to this story very well, but

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we had a dog that we loved and she was

older and, , we just knew that we weren't

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gonna do anything until she had passed

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Erika: Yeah.

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Shari: That was, that was

sort of our rough timeline.

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We also knew that we had to save up a

lot of money, , and , we did a lot of

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research and we also looked at how much

money we had spent on, , trips that

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we had taken already in our lives, and

decided that we felt pretty confident in

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spending about a thousand dollars a week

that we could, we could make that work.

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So we knew we had to save up

$52,000 to do this trip as

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Erika: Okay.

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Shari: So that was sort of the baseline.

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So we were kind of waiting on, on Cali to,

you know, pass on and we were also trying

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to save up money and at the same time we

had some debt that we needed to pay off.

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So we were very aggressive in the

financial aspect of this, getting

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rid of the debt and saving the

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Erika: Okay.

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, Shari: then when, when we did save the

money and when Callie was gone, , that's

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when we really like kicked into high gear.

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Like, let's figure out when we're gonna

start this trip and And at that point

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we kind of had a rough route, I guess.

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Like we knew generally

where we wanted to go.

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We.

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Had made a plan that, again, we used that

big map and just kind of plastered it with

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pins of what places we wanted to visit.

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And we kind of realized pretty

quickly that is a long time, but

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it's not long enough to see the whole

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Erika: Yeah.

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Shari: So we had to eliminate some places

and we just made sort of, , broad swift

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decisions that we were not going to go

to Africa, we were not gonna go to India.

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We were just kind of cutting those off.

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And we basically, , concentrated on

dividing the year into, into thirds.

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And we did a third in Europe, a third

in Asia, and a third in Latin America.

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Erika: Okay.

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, Shari: so that, yeah,

so that was the general.

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Ahead of time.

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The, the general prep to get to the

leaving phase, and then just sort

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of, , I guess basic logistical things

when you, when you leave for a year.

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We, we owned a home and we found renters.

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, we sold a bunch of stuff.

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We put a bunch of stuff in storage.

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, we sold a, a car, things like that.

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So just getting ready to

really be gone for a while.

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, we told all of our clients that we were

taking a sabbatical, kinds of things.

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Erika: When you shared this plan with

people, what was the general response, and

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did you get any surprising, uh, reactions?

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, Shari: we got a lot of, of

excitement and support, which was

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Erika: Good.

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Shari: Our parents initially

were like, what are you doing?

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You guys are kind of out of your

minds, like, you need to keep working.

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You need to keep building your careers.

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, but , they came around

very quickly because they.

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They appreciated that we had a

passion for travel and that this was a

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really good opportunity that we could

take advantage of, and that we had

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planned it out pretty well and , felt

confident in our ability to do it.

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, and then were all incredibly supportive,

which I think we were the most

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scared of, was that they were gonna.

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know, just be like, no, I, you know, I've

been working with you for however long.

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I'm not on board with you, just ditching

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Erika: Yeah.

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Shari: Um, they, everyone

was basically really excited.

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And then we also got a lot of responses

along the lines of, , that's amazing.

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I wish I could do

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Erika: Yes.

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I.

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Shari: that was a very interesting, , to

encounter because our typical response

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was, well, you probably can, you know,

it might take some sacrifices or some

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reevaluating of what you want your life

to look like and when you wanna hit some,

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some goals that you may have, whether

they're conscious or subconscious.

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But it is totally possible whether you

have a full-time job, whether you have

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kids, there's ways to do things always.

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Erika: I love that.

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'cause this is the type of thing that,

I know it's not for everybody, but I

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think there's a lot of people who are

like, God, I wish I could do that.

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But there's a million reasons

that anybody could come up with

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to put, to create barriers in

between executing a plan like this.

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So I just think it's so impressive and

cool that y'all a, that you're in a

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relationship where you and your partner

in are in sync with wanting to do kind

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of a drastic lifestyle change together.

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, but it's just, yeah, I am.

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Endlessly inspired by y'all.

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, so you broke your year up into thirds.

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You sold what you could and, uh, took off.

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How much planning within that year,

like how far in advance did you know

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where you were gonna sleep or what

city you were gonna be in and kind

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of like once you were on the ground?

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How did that go?

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Shari: That's a great question.

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, we were a little anal about it,

more so than I, than I think in

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retrospect, than we wish we had been.

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, or could have been we, there was a

lot of people who were excited for us.

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, we are lucky in that a lot of people

wanted to meet up with us throughout.

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Erika: Awesome.

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Shari: the year, and because of that, we

kind of had to nail down where, when we

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were gonna be in certain places at what

time so that other people could make

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their plans to meet us there and book

their accommodations and things like

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Erika: Yeah.

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, Shari: so we actually really

did plan it out pretty well.

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, and we did as much research

as we could ahead of time.

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, we did a really intensive job of

that for the first portion of the

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trip, the first third in Europe.

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, that was like completely

planned almost by the day.

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And we had, , tons of research ahead

of time on where we were going in

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all of those places and our, our maps

that we had made with different, sites

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and restaurants and things like that.

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And then, then we started

getting a little tired

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Erika: Yeah.

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Shari: as we were traveling because

there's only so much time you can

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or want to spend, you know, on.

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Your computer, your phone while you are

out in the world seeing these places

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that you've never been to before.

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, so then we got a little looser and sort

of just started winging it at some point.

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But , we did have the first third

for sure was like nailed down

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before we left the second portion.

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Asia, we, we had a general idea.

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We knew like what countries

we wanted to go to mainly.

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And for instance, with China,

we needed to send passports away

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to get the visas put in them.

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So that all had to happen ahead of

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Erika: Sure.

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, Shari: so things like that.

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And then, , well, I don't know if you

wanna jump to this yet, but then something

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happened while we were in Asia and that

sort of changed the end of the trip.

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, Erika: okay, I think I remember

what this is and we can jump to it.

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'cause my next question was gonna be , did

anything crazy happen or did anything go

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wrong that derailed any of your plans?

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So

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Shari: So, so much crazy

things happen and so much went

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wrong, but it's all part of the

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Erika: this is true.

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Shari: one, of the things that I can

think of just right off the top of my

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head was probably biggest mistake, and

this is completely on me because, , I

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should say also gonna back up a little

bit into the, the planning aspect.

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, we, we are fans of Points of Miles and

we kind of play that game a little bit.

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So that was another reason that

we had to sort of, , , schedule

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things a little more ahead of time

to utilize those points of miles.

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, so that it did help keep, uh, keep

our costs down throughout the trip.

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And one of the things that we had booked

was, , to jump from Europe to Asia.

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We were going from , Croatia

to Beijing and we.

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We were gonna use miles for this.

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And, , I found a pretty good option that

had a layover in Russia and it was, it

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was a good option because it was like a

business class flight for not a lot of

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Erika: Great.

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Shari: super excited about

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Erika: Yes.

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Duh.

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Shari: know, why not?

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, but it was it was two legs with, you

know, the, the layover in Russia, the

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first leg was actually just coach, and

the second leg was gonna be business

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Erika: Okay.

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Shari: And then when I went

to book it, it wouldn't let me

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book the business class portion.

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was a weird thing with the points

or miles and, , and because the,

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the both legs weren't in the

same, , fair class, it was just gonna

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bump both of them down to coach.

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Mm-hmm.

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So I know I was really

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Erika: nobody wants that.

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Shari: nobody wants that.

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So I just.

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Did a little digging, and I realized that

for the same amount of miles I could book

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the legs separately so I could book the

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Erika: Mm.

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Shari: portion from Croatia to Russia.

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And then the business, , class

portion from Russia to, , Beijing.

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that's what I did.

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Great.

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All set.

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And we're, you know, we're

traveling and we're ready to

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get under, get on our flight.

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We head to the airport in Croatia,

and we, , luckily had checked in ahead

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of time online and we just go , to

show, to show our passports and do

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all of the stuff you need to do when

you're traveling internationally.

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the man at the counter was like,

you can't get on this flight.

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I'm not gonna let you get on this flight.

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And we were like, what do you mean, why?

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And he said, well, you

don't have visas for Russia.

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And we were like, oh, no, no, no.

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We're just, it's just a layover.

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We're just gonna be there

for like an hour and a half.

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We're not leaving the airport.

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It's totally fine.

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He is like, yeah, but you

didn't book this as one ticket.

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It's not a through ticket.

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Erika: Oh no.

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Shari: Yes.

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So, , we spent, oh, I don't know,

maybe 45 minutes, refusing to

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leave, , this conversation with this

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Erika: Yeah,

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, Shari: and basically , , we convinced

him that, that he would, he was

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gonna let us get on this flight.

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, we had to swear up and down to not

look at anyone, talk to anyone, leave

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the gate, leave, obviously leave the

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Erika: yeah.

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Shari: I mean, he said his job was on

the line, but we knew that if we, if

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we said, oh, you know, that's too bad.

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We'll figure something out

and walked away, we were

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Erika: Yeah.

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Shari: So, , this is one of the less,

the big lessons, the big takeaways from

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traveling is, . take no for an answer.

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Like, you know, you always just kind

of push in every other alternative

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you can offer up any solution you

can think of to have, , whoever's

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helping you actually help you

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Erika: Yes,

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Shari: it work.

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Erika: that is

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Shari: And

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Erika: good advice.

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Shari: yeah, we,

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Erika: Did you,

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Shari: we did throughout

the trip and continue to

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Erika: did you cry?

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Shari: I think I cried a little bit.

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Erika: Yeah.

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Shari: Yes.

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Erika: I, like maybe two years ago

had a a, a situation in Charles Dugal

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where I missed a connection and it was.

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Not entirely, not my fault.

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Um, but I just, everybody was so

unhelpful and I finally got to the

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right person and it was like I wasn't

taking no for an answer, same situation.

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And I cried, not out of weaponized tears,

but out of like genuine, just like, I

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don't know, I don't have anything else.

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I'm so, , just upset and need to get

to my, I think I was going to Milan.

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, and the tears though, immediately the

guy was like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa.

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Okay, fine.

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And then magically I was able

to get on the next flight.

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, so I agree with that.

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Don't take no for an answer.

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'cause sometimes they're just like,

sometimes they can help and they

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don't really wanna go through the,

the steps of the required help.

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So, okay.

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So you've been to

Russia, Russia's airport.

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Shari: We didn't, we didn't

breathe the air in Russia.

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We did not leave the terminal,

but we went to Russia.

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Erika: gosh.

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Okay.

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And then everything else went

okay with getting to China.

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Shari: Yes, yes.

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We made it to China just fine after

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Erika: Okay.

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Good.

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Shari: Had our lovely business

class seats on the second flight.

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Erika: The best.

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, okay, so now we're in.

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Your second third of your adventures,

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Shari: Correct?

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Erika: walk us through this.

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Shari: So I mean, there's,

there's so many stories I could

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tell, but, , , it was amazing.

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There's ups, there's downs.

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, you meet incredible people.

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It's the, the magic of travel,

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Erika: Mm-hmm.

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Absolutely.

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, , okay.

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Something else went wrong

in Asia though, right?

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Shari: Well, oh my gosh,

what else went wrong in Asia?

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, when we, uh, when we arrived

in Vietnam, we, it was the

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middle of a massive monsoon.

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Erika: Oops.

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Shari: and we, yeah, we were

completely soaked, uh, like water

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up to our knees, , just in the

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Erika: Oh my God.

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Shari: Yeah.

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Erika: Oh my God.

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Shari: so that was,

was a whole experience.

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, You know, it's makes for great stories.

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Erika: Absolutely.

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Shari: was, it was cool.

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But overall, no, everything went really

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Erika: Okay.

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Did you maybe, I'm like, am

I thinking of somebody else?

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Did you get bit by a dog?

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Shari: Oh my gosh.

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I did get bit by a dog that

was in, where was that?

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That was in Indonesia.

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Erika: Okay.

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Okay.

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I was like, am I thinking

of somebody else?

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, okay.

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But that didn't, that sucked,

but it didn't send you home.

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Shari: That sucked that.

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And again, that was completely my fault.

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, that was, we were on a tiny

island, , in Thailand and we were just

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hanging out on the beach one night.

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There was this cool bar, and I

had had, I had had, know, some

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Erika: Yeah.

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Shari: and there was this

very sweet looking rottweiler

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just hanging out at bar also.

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so I was petting him and I decided

that he needed his belly rubbed.

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, and so I was, you know, kind of just

like inching my hand towards his belly.

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:

And he was not doing the, the thing

that most dogs do when you go towards

395

:

the belly, where it's just like roll

over and completely expose their

396

:

Erika: Yeah.

397

:

Shari: So I just kind of push him on

the hip a little bit so that he would.

398

:

So that he would do the role,

and he did not like that.

399

:

And he just, he just bit, and I think it

was honestly more of like a, a warning,

400

:

Erika: Sure,

401

:

Shari: but he broke skin and, , it

was, we panicked a little bit just

402

:

because, , he, he was a stray,

like he didn't belong to anyone and

403

:

Erika: sure.

404

:

Shari: we went in the middle of nowhere.

405

:

, and rabies is, you know,

a fear anywhere you

406

:

Erika: Yeah,

407

:

, Shari: yeah, spoiler, I survived.

408

:

There was no rabies.

409

:

It was okay, but it was, it was

not a great night after that.

410

:

Erika: that's fair.

411

:

And that makes me think, did you, I

know I've been on trips where I either

412

:

need a visa or specific vaccinations.

413

:

Shari: Mm-hmm.

414

:

Erika: you left for this year, did

you go to a travel doctor and get.

415

:

You know, all sorts of inoculations

that you didn't have before.

416

:

Shari: We

417

:

Erika: Okay.

418

:

Shari: Yes.

419

:

Erika: you were like fresh on your rabies.

420

:

Shari: Uh, no, we didn't do the rabies

because rabies is one that, , at

421

:

the time that we were traveling,

they didn't really recommend it.

422

:

It's excessively expensive, , and

it's just not something that, , that

423

:

most people really need to get,

unless I guess they're gonna be

424

:

around a bunch of facts or something.

425

:

Erika: okay.

426

:

Shari: it was just, yeah, they, they were

like, I mean, we can give it to you, but

427

:

it's gonna cost you a ton of money and

it's probably not something you, you need.

428

:

And if you do encounter rabies,

if you get bit by something, you,

429

:

I think, gosh, don't quote me on

this, but I think you have like 24

430

:

hours to get the vaccine afterwards.

431

:

Um, I will say something that we also

learned through the, the process of

432

:

getting our vaccines ahead of time and

traveling for so long is that, , the

433

:

vaccines in the US are often way

more expensive than they are in other

434

:

Erika: Weird.

435

:

Shari: So.

436

:

Yeah, like a lot of things actually.

437

:

Erika: Yeah.

438

:

, Shari: so one of the vaccines that we

got, and I can't remember off the top of

439

:

my head which one it was, but it needed,

, three different at three different, , time

440

:

Erika: Okay.

441

:

Shari: they had to be a certain

amount of time spaced apart.

442

:

So we were able to get the first two while

we were still in the US before we left.

443

:

And then the third one we

actually had to get in Amsterdam.

444

:

And so we, you know, figured out where

we needed to go and when, and it was

445

:

I think probably a fifth of the price

of the shots we were getting in the US

446

:

Erika: And say,

447

:

Shari: you know, obviously we were

like, , how much do all the rest of these

448

:

costs that we just paid a ton of money

449

:

Erika: yeah,

450

:

Shari: in Atlanta and it was all

significantly less expensive.

451

:

Erika: uh, I totally believe that.

452

:

, Shari: Mm-hmm.

453

:

Erika: but also that is

a good thing to know.

454

:

, okay, so how long into

your trip did it take?

455

:

You to realize like, my

home is being rented.

456

:

I am like so out of my real life,

like, oh my God, we did this.

457

:

Like was it a slow buildup or

was it the second you stepped on

458

:

that plane, you mentally, you're

like, we're on sabbatical mode.

459

:

What was the like emotional

shift through all of this?

460

:

Shari: It actually happened in

Amsterdam, which was our second stop.

461

:

We went to Iceland first, and

then we went to Amsterdam after

462

:

Erika: Cool.

463

:

Shari: And at that point we had pro,

when we were leaving Amsterdam, we had

464

:

probably been traveling for I think two

and a half weeks, maybe three weeks at

465

:

Erika: Mm-hmm.

466

:

Shari: And I remember going to the airport

to leave Amsterdam to go onto our next

467

:

stop, our next destination, and looking

around at all of the other people who

468

:

were at the airport with us and thinking.

469

:

Wow.

470

:

Uh, like the majority of these people

were just, just had an awesome vacation

471

:

in Amsterdam and now they're going

home and they're going back to their

472

:

Erika: Yeah.

473

:

Shari: we're not.

474

:

Erika: Yeah.

475

:

That's amazing.

476

:

Ugh.

477

:

Okay.

478

:

What are, I assume throughout all

of this, you've learned a lot about

479

:

yourself, , because anytime you put

yourself in new and unique situations, you

480

:

uncover, , different aspects of yourself.

481

:

Is there anything that either you or Josh

have uncovered about yourselves or your

482

:

relationship dynamic that you wouldn't

have discovered without taking this step?

483

:

Shari: I dunno if we would've

discovered this, , through

484

:

other means, but we definitely

discovered a ton through this trip.

485

:

, one of the main things for me is that I'm

a lot stronger than I thought I was and

486

:

I can deal with a lot of things that I

thought I wouldn't be able to deal with.

487

:

, whether that's.

488

:

, setbacks that, that I, you know, kind

of maybe just would've given up on

489

:

before this trip, and now I know to just

keep pushing, , or just sort of being

490

:

in uncomfortable situations, , whether

that's, , an actual like encounter

491

:

that you're in or if it's, , sleeping,

sleeping situation, accommodations.

492

:

, I, I never considered myself like

a very fancy person, but I like

493

:

Erika: Yes.

494

:

, Shari: and, and I liked certain things.

495

:

You know, I was, I built a life that I

was happy with and very comfortable in.

496

:

And when you're traveling, you know,

you pare it down to the essentials,

497

:

so you know, what's, what's

most important to have with you?

498

:

, what's, who's most important to have with

499

:

Erika: Yeah.

500

:

, Shari: you need to keep in, in

contact with while you're traveling

501

:

and while you're away for so long?

502

:

And also just like, kind of what, what is

the bare minimum that you can survive on?

503

:

Erika: Yeah.

504

:

And were you surprised by like

how little you could survive on

505

:

Shari: Yeah.

506

:

, I, I was impressed with myself with how

little I packed, which was really good.

507

:

, , we both took a carry-on suitcase,

508

:

Erika: wow.

509

:

Shari: a large carry-on suitcase.

510

:

Like at some, for some,

, airlines, we did have to

511

:

Erika: Mm-hmm.

512

:

Shari: for the majority of the

bigger carriers, it was a carry-on.

513

:

and for a whole year.

514

:

Yeah, that's, that was pretty amazing.

515

:

And I will say was challenging, like there

was, I did kind of get rid of some of my

516

:

clothes throughout the process and get new

517

:

Erika: Yeah,

518

:

Shari: it was just a little hard

to wear the same thing all the

519

:

Erika: that makes sense.

520

:

Shari: it's

521

:

Erika: Yeah.

522

:

Shari: totally doable.

523

:

Erika: That's amazing.

524

:

, all right, so your second third

was in Asia, then you moved on.

525

:

Did you do South and Latin

America, or just Latin America?

526

:

Shari: Well, so we had fully

planned to do South America.

527

:

And then the, the main thing that

happened while we were in Asia that

528

:

that changed the trip that changed

our lives really, is that, , one of

529

:

our good friends, , Phil, who also

530

:

Erika: Mm-hmm.

531

:

, Shari: he, he wanted to meet us in Hong

532

:

Erika: Um.

533

:

Shari: So, we met up with him in

Hong Kong and , you know, we hadn't

534

:

seen him in, I don't know, months or

so, and we're just, you know, really

535

:

catching up and all of this stuff.

536

:

And, and he asked us at one point, we

were, , on our way to see the big Buddha

537

:

and we're in the, , what are they called?

538

:

Like the ski lift things?

539

:

The

540

:

Erika: Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

541

:

Shari: Yep.

542

:

, so we're just riding that up and he

just looked at us and he was like.

543

:

Are you guys really just gonna go back

to Atlanta when this year is over?

544

:

And Josh and I both like froze and then

looked at each other and we were like,

545

:

um, we have not even thought about that

because we were just so in the moment

546

:

and so focused on what we were doing

that day, what we were doing the next

547

:

day, what our next destination was,

that we just had not even thought about

548

:

would happen when the trip was over.

549

:

Erika: Yeah.

550

:

Shari: And so, , it was really

great that Phil kind of shoved that

551

:

in our faces because it made us

reevaluate, , because both of us.

552

:

Had sort of the same gut reaction,

which was, no, we don't wanna go

553

:

back to the life we had before.

554

:

Erika: Yeah.

555

:

, Shari: so that, that made us just really

reevaluate, like, look at was important

556

:

to us at, at this point in our lives.

557

:

, having, you know, changed, like you

said, through travel, , and, and

558

:

prioritize those things and figure

out what was the next step for us.

559

:

And that didn't necessarily mean

not going back to the us but when

560

:

we looked at those priorities,

which, , involved working less, , not

561

:

having, which also in turn meant not

having as large a cost of living.

562

:

, we had spent a lot of the trip being

close to the ocean and sort of,

563

:

kind of chasing summer a little bit.

564

:

, and living, living close to

nature and especially the

565

:

ocean had become a priority.

566

:

, I have an intestinal

disease that is manageable.

567

:

I had been doing fine with it

in, , when we lived in Atlanta.

568

:

I would off and on, have

some issues, nothing too

569

:

Erika: Yeah.

570

:

Shari: but while we

traveled, I had no problems.

571

:

And I really attribute that to, I mean,

who knows, but I really attribute that

572

:

to the, , quality of food that, that

I was able to eat in other countries.

573

:

And not necessarily that it's like

fancy organic food, but that it was

574

:

being farmed with less chemicals and

it was in general less processed to

575

:

then what I was eating in the us.

576

:

Erika: yeah.

577

:

Shari: so that was also a

578

:

Erika: Mm-hmm.

579

:

, Shari: and what we kind of evaluated all

those things together, , it, it became

580

:

kind of evident that the US maybe wasn't

the best option for us if we wanted to.

581

:

uh, achieve all those goals, I

582

:

Erika: Yeah.

583

:

Shari: and we decided that Mexico was

probably a great option for us, and

584

:

therefore we shifted the last third of

the trip to focus less on South America

585

:

and kind of get to Mexico a little

faster and take some time in theory

586

:

to check out different parts of Mexico

and see if one of them clicked with

587

:

us and if that would be our next home.

588

:

Erika: Okay.

589

:

, it's funny you say that.

590

:

I, I think everybody who's

traveled outside the US.

591

:

Quickly realizes the

difference in the food.

592

:

, and just last week I saw an article, I

think it was a tennis player, but don't

593

:

quote me on the sport, but there's an

athlete from, I don't remember where, who

594

:

was coming to play a tournament or event

or something in the US and he was like,

595

:

I have to travel with like a chef because

the food here like fucks up my stomach.

596

:

Like I like can't eat this food.

597

:

It's poison to me.

598

:

, and it's just, there's so many things

that travel is great for, but there's a

599

:

lot of stuff that like, you just can't

learn about your life and your options

600

:

and unless you step back from it.

601

:

, so that's such an interesting, like aha.

602

:

And I know a lot of people who are

glutenin sensitive in the US and

603

:

then they go to Italy and they're

like, oh, it's actually fine.

604

:

Hmm.

605

:

, so you, had you been to Mexico before?

606

:

Shari: We have been to Mexico

before, , but only to the, let's

607

:

see, we had been to the East coast.

608

:

We had been to Tulum and

Isla, Mo Harris, and we

609

:

Erika: I.

610

:

Shari: to the Baja

Peninsula, so that was it.

611

:

So we didn't have a lot of exposure to

612

:

Erika: And did you speak Spanish?

613

:

Shari: No.

614

:

Uh, I took Spanish in high school,

which was pretty much worthless, and

615

:

Josh had taken French in high school.

616

:

So, no, we, we were really

starting from zero pretty much.

617

:

Erika: Okay.

618

:

So you, in this last third of your, of

your travels, you've explored Mexico

619

:

and you found on the West coast a town

that just like made you very, like, did

620

:

you immediately feel like this is it?

621

:

Shari: I

622

:

Erika: Oh, that's so cool.

623

:

Shari: Yeah.

624

:

And we, and, and we had

still, , traveled elsewhere in

625

:

Latin America before we got to

626

:

Erika: Okay.

627

:

Shari: knew that we wanted to end

the trip in Mexico and kind of expand

628

:

that a little longer so that we'd

have time to really investigate.

629

:

so as we made our way to Mexico, we

were kind of, , working on Spanish.

630

:

We took, , a Spanish intensive

course in Guatemala, which was

631

:

amazing and so incredibly helpful.

632

:

, and then, yeah, we got to Mexico and

we decided to start, , our search, we

633

:

kind of narrowed down to three different

areas of Mexico and we started in the

634

:

one that we thought was gonna be the most

likely that we would, , connect with.

635

:

And.

636

:

And the reason that we did that was

because, um, or the reason that we

637

:

knew about that was because some

friends of ours, , used to come

638

:

to this area on vacation every

639

:

Erika: Oh, cool.

640

:

Shari: So they had been telling us for

years, you guys need to go check out this

641

:

area, you would love it, blah, blah, blah.

642

:

And we were like, yeah,

yeah, we'll get there.

643

:

It's just, you know, we live on the

east coast of the US so it's hard

644

:

to get to the west coast of Mexico.

645

:

Erika: I.

646

:

, Shari: so when we decided to check

out Mexico, that was at the top of

647

:

our list and we kind of checked out

a few different towns in that area.

648

:

And, , immediately when we got to the

town that we live in now, , I think

649

:

the second day there we were like,

well, let's go talk to a realtor.

650

:

Like, let's make an appointment.

651

:

Erika: That's so cool.

652

:

And the town you're in now, is that the

town that your friend had suggested?

653

:

Shari: It

654

:

Erika: Wow.

655

:

You know, they're like adding

themselves on their backs.

656

:

That's amazing.

657

:

Okay, so throughout this year of travel,

you come to the realization that you

658

:

don't want to return to your regular

lives in the us you make it to this

659

:

Mexican town, you decide this is it,

you talk to a realtor, and then what?

660

:

Shari: And then we, , the realtor

basically took us around and

661

:

showed us what was available.

662

:

Uh, we didn't, we had this idea that we

wanted to find land, but we weren't sold

663

:

Erika: Mm-hmm.

664

:

, Shari: so they, they

showed us some houses.

665

:

They showed us some lots

that were available.

666

:

, we were not really, we were

kind of bummed actually 'cause

667

:

we weren't loving anything.

668

:

, and then at sort of the end of that

day, , he said, you know, there's

669

:

one other lot that I think you might.

670

:

Be interested.

671

:

And he is like, but it's not

officially on the market, let's go

672

:

look at it and we'll see if it's,

if it's something that appeals to

673

:

you, and then we can dig into it.

674

:

So we did and we were

like, yes, this is it.

675

:

This is what we

676

:

Erika: That's awesome.

677

:

Shari: yeah, it was great.

678

:

, and so then, , he went back to his

office and kind of conferred with the,

679

:

company and the woman who owned the land.

680

:

we basically came to an agreement,

you know, we made an offer and

681

:

she accepted it and there was, you

know, all the realtor things that

682

:

need to happen and the legalities.

683

:

but it, during the, that time we went

back to the US and, , put our house

684

:

up for sale and kind of packed up all

of our things, sold a bunch of things,

685

:

and got ready to move to Mexico.

686

:

So by the time, it basically took, from

the time that we, made the offer on

687

:

the land to the time that we actually.

688

:

Got back to Mexico was about six months.

689

:

Let's talk about one of my favorite

daily habits, the Five Minute Journal.

690

:

It's exactly what it sounds like.

691

:

Just five minutes in the morning and at

night to get clear on your intentions.

692

:

Focus on what you're grateful

for and reflect on your day.

693

:

It's quick, it's easy, and

it actually helps shift your

694

:

mindset in a real lasting way.

695

:

No overthinking, no pressure.

696

:

Just a few minutes that

make a big difference.

697

:

If you're looking to feel a little

more grounded and a lot more focused,

698

:

check it out@hawkinsandclover.com.

699

:

Erika: Were there any details of buying

that property that differ from doing so

700

:

in the US that you weren't prepared for?

701

:

Shari: Yes.

702

:

Um, I

703

:

Erika: I.

704

:

Shari: I think there's

a lot of differences.

705

:

, but I will say working with a realtor is

something that I'd recommend for anyone

706

:

buying in Mexico because they really

the process so much and make it, um,

707

:

Erika: Mm-hmm.

708

:

Shari: Uh, it's, it's, it's complicated

anywhere I think to buy property.

709

:

, and Mexico is certainly no exception.

710

:

, one of the things that I.

711

:

That we get asked about a lot that,

, there is a misconception about is that

712

:

foreigners cannot buy land in Mexico,

and that is absolutely not the case.

713

:

, there are different procedures that

have to happen, , one being if you

714

:

buy within a certain distance of

the coast or the borders, so the

715

:

border with the US and the north,

716

:

Erika: Mm-hmm.

717

:

, Shari: you, you have to buy it

through, , what's called a fi miso,

718

:

which is basically a bank trust.

719

:

So the bank is technically the owner

of the property and you just, you

720

:

are the beneficiary of the trust.

721

:

, and you just have to pay a, an annual

maintenance fee to the bank for this.

722

:

It's very nominal.

723

:

It's like a hundred bucks a year.

724

:

Erika: Okay.

725

:

Shari: deal.

726

:

And that's, so, and that's

something that's, , that's super

727

:

standard and that is really secure.

728

:

And it's something that even if, , say

an American or a Canadian bought land

729

:

on the coast of Mexico through used a

fi miso and then they passed away, , the

730

:

ownership would still just continue on

to whoever their, their beneficiary is.

731

:

So it's not like there's any

concerns about the security of it.

732

:

Erika: That's so interesting.

733

:

Okay.

734

:

And did you have to use this?

735

:

'cause you're that close to the beach?

736

:

I.

737

:

Shari: are.

738

:

Yes.

739

:

Yeah, we're just a few blocks

740

:

Erika: Oh my gosh, that's so amazing.

741

:

, okay, so, uh, if I'm not

mistaken, you also did some

742

:

construction on this property.

743

:

Shari: We did.

744

:

Yes.

745

:

Yes.

746

:

So we bought the land and we,

our plan was, , again, based on

747

:

our travels, , we stayed while

we were traveling, we stayed in.

748

:

sorts of accommodations.

749

:

So we stayed in hotels, we stayed

in hostels, we stayed in Airbnbs.

750

:

and some of them were amazing

and some of them were terrible.

751

:

I remember thinking like, huh, know,

these people own these terrible

752

:

Airbnbs are making enough money

to live by doing basically a shit

753

:

Erika: yeah.

754

:

Shari: at their job.

755

:

And like, we could do this so much

756

:

Erika: Yeah.

757

:

Shari: And I, I will say also, we, before

we left, one of the ways that we paid off

758

:

our debt and saved money was we, , went,

rented one of the rooms in our house in

759

:

Atlanta on Airbnb that, that extra income.

760

:

Erika: Nice.

761

:

Shari: And it was such a great experience.

762

:

Like we were really nervous

about it when we first did it.

763

:

And Airbnb is so standard now,

but at the time it just wasn't.

764

:

Erika: You were a pioneer.

765

:

Brave.

766

:

Shari: so we were really nervous to

just have strangers staying in our

767

:

Erika: Yeah.

768

:

, Shari: but it was, it was amazing.

769

:

Like every, it was really cool to

meet people from all over the world.

770

:

It was also really cool chat with them

and help them have a good experience

771

:

in Atlanta, because I can't even tell

you how many people came and said, oh

772

:

yeah, we're gonna go to Underground.

773

:

That sounds super fun.

774

:

And we were like, no, that's

not a good idea at all.

775

:

Erika: Yeah.

776

:

Shari: Why don't we

think about this instead?

777

:

, and then people were really grateful

and had, you know, like we would suggest

778

:

like KRA Street or Pond City Market,

and they'd be like, that was so cool.

779

:

And I didn't see that anywhere

in my research for Atlanta.

780

:

And again, this was years ago, but

it was, it was very, , fulfilling

781

:

to help people have a good trip.

782

:

So we weren't, we weren't newbies to

the, to the Airbnb hosting experience.

783

:

So as we were traveling, we, I literally

had, , in my notes app on my phone,

784

:

I was making notes about things that

Airbnbs should have and shouldn't have

785

:

to let the guests have a good experience.

786

:

And so when, when we decided that

we were gonna move to Mexico, , and

787

:

the idea was to work less, , idea

of building, uh, rental units was,

788

:

was what we really focused on.

789

:

So we, we bought the, the land

and then we built, , a property

790

:

with three buildings on it.

791

:

So basically one of them was our

home, and then the others were rental

792

:

Erika: Okay.

793

:

Shari: And so that's what

we did for a little while.

794

:

But our timing was, , really

unfortunate because we finished the

795

:

construction and opened for business.

796

:

Like we accepted our first guests

at the very end of January,:

797

:

And then we had about six, six

weeks of, , of great experiences

798

:

with cool guests and lots of, , a

great response to the listings.

799

:

And, you know, pretty much like the

year was almost completely booked.

800

:

Then we got shut down.

801

:

Obviously the, the whole world got

802

:

Erika: Yeah.

803

:

Oh, that's insane timing.

804

:

Shari: Mm-hmm.

805

:

, Erika: okay.

806

:

When did you get back up, up and

running, or did you have to pivot?

807

:

Like how did you navigate that?

808

:

Shari: We did, , it, it actually was

kind of, , not the end of the world,

809

:

, because there was certain things that

we had wanted to do on, , for the rental

810

:

units that we just ran out of time for.

811

:

We just needed to open

them and start bringing in

812

:

Erika: Mm-hmm.

813

:

Shari: So we kind of reset

and, , and realized that

814

:

people needed different things.

815

:

Once people were able to travel again,

for instance, with, , remote work becoming

816

:

so doable, we realized that like each

room needed a space to work, a desk,

817

:

Erika: Yeah.

818

:

, Shari: so we, yeah, we sort of like

pivoted slightly, but not a ton.

819

:

And then we reopened, I believe it was.

820

:

Oh gosh, maybe three months later, four

821

:

Erika: Yeah.

822

:

Shari: I can't quite remember.

823

:

and it was weird because we, we basically

exclusively had, , people from Guadalajara

824

:

who could, 'cause it's not that far.

825

:

It's like a, well, at the time it was

about a four and a half hour drive.

826

:

Now it's a little quicker

'cause there's a toll road, but.

827

:

, they were coming essentially for

the weekend because they were so

828

:

trapped in their apartment, in their

city, , with no exposure to anyone

829

:

else that they just needed to get out

and be in nature and have a vacation.

830

:

, so we were basically getting like

these, these weekend visitors and

831

:

no one would really talk to anyone.

832

:

It was very siloed.

833

:

, but it was nice to feel like, okay, like

this, you know, people are feeling good

834

:

being here, and that's, that's nice and

835

:

Erika: Yeah.

836

:

, Shari: and then obviously it

opened up more and more and

837

:

then, and then it got weird.

838

:

It got really weird.

839

:

Erika: Ooh.

840

:

Shari: then we started getting like

tra normal travelers again from all

841

:

over the world, , that were staying

for a week or however long, 10 days.

842

:

almost every single one of them was awful.

843

:

it was so strange.

844

:

I mean, I don't, I don't

think they're terrible people.

845

:

I think it was just, , a

product at the pandemic, but

846

:

people just felt that they had.

847

:

They had been cooped up for so

long and they were spending this

848

:

money and this time to do this trip

and it needed to be perfect and

849

:

they needed to be taken care of.

850

:

And I felt like a babysitter

rather than a host.

851

:

It was what people were asking us for

and the lack of respect for, for our

852

:

privacy and our lives that we got.

853

:

I had one at one point, I think

at like one 30 in the morning.

854

:

I had, , this woman texting

me, asking me to bring her a

855

:

tampon, like things like that.

856

:

Yeah.

857

:

Erika: I was hoping you would offer

up examples 'cause it's like I what?

858

:

Shari: Mm-hmm.

859

:

Yeah.

860

:

Yeah.

861

:

So it was not, it got to be not what we

had up for, , and not what we wanted.

862

:

And it would've changed, obviously.

863

:

It definitely would've changed,

but we were not happy in the

864

:

Erika: Mm-hmm.

865

:

, Shari: At the same time, one of our

friends who's a realtor said, Hey, I

866

:

have a client that's looking for what

you guys have, they want, , a multi-unit

867

:

property that, that there's , , a

place for the owner to live, an owner

868

:

Erika: Mm-hmm.

869

:

, Shari: would you be interested

in, in showing your property?

870

:

And we were like, whoa, that wasn't

our plan at all, but us think about it.

871

:

And then we thought about it

and we were like, I mean, yeah,

872

:

like, we'll be open to it.

873

:

Let's see.

874

:

And, , and in the meantime, the,

the client wasn't gonna be available

875

:

to come see it for a few weeks.

876

:

So in the meantime, we're just,

our are churning and we're like,

877

:

well, what would we do if we sold

878

:

Erika: Yeah.

879

:

Shari: And then we started thinking about

other projects we could do and other

880

:

opportunities, and got super excited about

the idea of like renovating an older home.

881

:

, and so I.

882

:

Basically we got an offer on the

place and we, we took advantage of

883

:

that and said, yes, let's, let's move

884

:

Erika: Oh my God, I

didn't know you did that.

885

:

That's so exciting.

886

:

Shari: up selling.

887

:

Oh yes.

888

:

Erika: Okay.

889

:

Shari: we sold, um, which

was very unexpected.

890

:

, and then we, yeah, we wound up

buying an older home that we

891

:

completely gutted and, and renovated.

892

:

And that was a super exciting process too.

893

:

And that's where we are

894

:

Erika: Oh my God, you guys are so cool.

895

:

Um, wow.

896

:

Okay.

897

:

I'm, I'm just like processing this.

898

:

What, what I really like about the story

is how I feel like you kind of just like

899

:

threw it up to the universe and you

guys have been provided for in ways you

900

:

couldn't have even imagined with every

kind of act of faith in just trusting

901

:

that this is gonna unfold because it

feels like the right path for you.

902

:

Shari: I would agree with

903

:

Erika: That's so special.

904

:

Shari: feel very lucky.

905

:

Erika: Yeah.

906

:

Okay.

907

:

So you just did a, a complete

renovation of, , a beautiful old

908

:

Mexican home that's so fucking badass.

909

:

Is there anything crazy about doing

construction in another country

910

:

compared to your experiences in the us?

911

:

Shari: Absolutely.

912

:

Well, to be fair, we never

did construction in the

913

:

Erika: Okay.

914

:

Shari: we just, , bought a home,

an older home and lived in it.

915

:

Josh is super handy.

916

:

, he actually grew up um,

construction more or less.

917

:

His dad was a, , a, a

hardscape landscape architect.

918

:

he sort of had exposure to that early

on, and his parents built, literally

919

:

built their home with their bare

920

:

Erika: Wow.

921

:

, Shari: so he, he knows a lot

and he is skilled in that.

922

:

No, I am, I sit behind a computer.

923

:

I don't, I don't know any of that

924

:

Erika: But you do have a good eye for

design, so surely that came in handy.

925

:

Shari: Yes.

926

:

Yes.

927

:

I definitely like to do the, the design

aspect of things and the aesthetics.

928

:

Erika: I.

929

:

Shari: and Josh is

great at that stuff too.

930

:

I mean, he is a creative as

well, but it's, I, yeah, I sort

931

:

of back to that trusting thing.

932

:

I sort of just really had faith

in Josh and his, his abilities.

933

:

, and he is really come through, but as

far as construction in another country,

934

:

, the, the biggest thing is the language

935

:

Erika: Yeah.

936

:

, Shari: and we've, I mean, we've been

in Mexico now for over six years.

937

:

, we we're absolutely not fluent.

938

:

Erika: Okay.

939

:

Shari: but we get by and we're

always working to, , increase

940

:

our Spanish and, you know.

941

:

be as good as we can with it.

942

:

But when we started, we

had basically just arrived.

943

:

, and Josh very quickly learned

sort of construction Spanish so

944

:

that he could communicate with the

workers and everything like that.

945

:

And that was great.

946

:

But it is, I don't wanna, I don't

wanna be broad about this and say all

947

:

construction in Mexico, but where we

live, it's, it's a very small town.

948

:

, there's, we're north of Perta,

so there is, , city nearby, but

949

:

I wouldn't say we have, , like

a plethora of super qualified,

950

:

experienced contractors or workers

951

:

Erika: Okay.

952

:

Shari: So it definitely is, , a situation

where you need to, like, one of our top

953

:

pieces of advice for anyone who's doing

construction here is to be on site as

954

:

much as possible because things will.

955

:

Absolutely go wrong over and over.

956

:

And the more, the more onsite

you can be, the more you'll catch

957

:

and the smoother things will go.

958

:

So that's kind of the biggest thing.

959

:

So that was basically Josh's job for

the, it took us with the first property.

960

:

It took us, , 11 months to do

construction and he was there every

961

:

day, , doing physical labor with the

guys and really just being on top of it.

962

:

then the renovation, I think

took, shoot, I think that was

963

:

about four and a half or five

964

:

Erika: Okay.

965

:

, Shari: and he also was, , pretty

much on site as much as he could be.

966

:

Erika: Okay.

967

:

That's so cool.

968

:

, so you don't have your

Airbnb income anymore?

969

:

, how are you surviving?

970

:

Shari: Good question.

971

:

, we're still figuring that out.

972

:

No, not really.

973

:

We, do a variety of things.

974

:

, I ha I have been a graphic designer

for most of my career, , and I still

975

:

do that a little bit on the side,

which is mainly, , licensing my designs

976

:

to different stationary companies.

977

:

So minted is one that most people would've

978

:

Erika: Yeah.

979

:

, Shari: Then I also, , and this is

another kind of trust the universe thing.

980

:

, we, we took a trip last year

to, , to Africa and we were sitting

981

:

in an airport in, . Where were we?

982

:

Zambia.

983

:

our flight was crazy

delayed, like seven hours.

984

:

Erika: Oh.

985

:

Shari: just sitting in this airport

and there's this other couple that

986

:

was sitting there nearby and we

started chatting with them and you

987

:

know, like, what are you doing?

988

:

Why are you on this trip, blah blah.

989

:

And she , she was a travel advisor.

990

:

And I was like, oh, that's so interesting.

991

:

Like, I'm so passionate about travel,

like I've always been interested in that.

992

:

Tell me about your job.

993

:

And she talked to me

for like hours about it.

994

:

And the more she talked,

the more intrigued I was.

995

:

And she said, you know, when you're back

from your trip, I'm happy to chat more.

996

:

Give me a call.

997

:

So I did.

998

:

And then she said, if you're

interested, I can put you in

999

:

touch with the head of my agency.

:

00:47:13,318 --> 00:47:15,718

And so I said, sure, okay, let's do that.

:

00:47:15,778 --> 00:47:17,578

And then just one thing led to another.

:

00:47:17,578 --> 00:47:21,748

And now I am doing trip trip

planning for a company called

:

00:47:21,748 --> 00:47:23,998

Child Bambino, which I'm loving.

:

00:47:24,478 --> 00:47:27,928

So I'm basically just

kind of working on my.

:

00:47:28,763 --> 00:47:32,213

of my three passions in the world

I would say are travel and design.

:

00:47:32,213 --> 00:47:36,413

So I'm, I'm kind of professionally working

in both of those, which is incredible.

:

00:47:36,747 --> 00:47:38,217

Erika: so cool.

:

00:47:38,963 --> 00:47:39,293

Shari: Yeah.

:

00:47:39,653 --> 00:47:39,953

Yeah.

:

00:47:40,017 --> 00:47:41,577

Erika: I love how so seamless.

:

00:47:43,013 --> 00:47:46,013

Shari: Josh is, , he was a

photographer when we lived in Atlanta.

:

00:47:46,013 --> 00:47:47,933

, he, he shot a lot for Atlanta magazine.

:

00:47:48,143 --> 00:47:51,213

He did commercial photography,

, which is not so easy for him to

:

00:47:51,213 --> 00:47:54,543

do here, but he also did a lot

of architectural photography.

:

00:47:54,873 --> 00:47:58,953

So he does shoot a bit here

for, , for homes that are for sale.

:

00:47:58,983 --> 00:48:03,333

And then he, his main thing is that he

does retouching for other photographers.

:

00:48:03,753 --> 00:48:07,923

So he is worked on quite a few

pretty cool projects for that.

:

00:48:08,082 --> 00:48:09,127

Erika: that's amazing.

:

00:48:10,143 --> 00:48:10,683

Shari: Yeah.

:

00:48:11,317 --> 00:48:15,547

Erika: Um, and so you guys also just

combined your creative backgrounds to

:

00:48:15,547 --> 00:48:19,177

collaborate on a really fun project,

which is writing your first book.

:

00:48:20,043 --> 00:48:20,523

Shari: Yes.

:

00:48:20,523 --> 00:48:25,473

So we did, yeah, nothing that, that

we ever expected to do, but we did.

:

00:48:25,657 --> 00:48:27,262

Erika: Ugh, it's so amazing.

:

00:48:27,442 --> 00:48:32,032

So I assume, so again, this book is

titled The Young Expats Guide to Mexico.

:

00:48:32,312 --> 00:48:35,042

, I assume you've been hammered

with like questions from people

:

00:48:35,042 --> 00:48:36,362

of like, how do you do it?

:

00:48:36,392 --> 00:48:37,532

Like where do you even begin?

:

00:48:37,532 --> 00:48:40,232

Kind of all the stuff that we're

chatting about for this episode.

:

00:48:40,422 --> 00:48:43,992

, and so is that kind of the essence

of this book is , here's what we

:

00:48:43,992 --> 00:48:45,162

wish we'd known, here's how to do it.

:

00:48:46,658 --> 00:48:49,868

Shari: It is a hundred percent is

exactly what we wish we had known.

:

00:48:49,918 --> 00:48:54,478

, when we decided to make the move, we

did a little bit of research into,

:

00:48:54,508 --> 00:48:57,088

we did a ton of research, but we

did a little bit of research into

:

00:48:57,088 --> 00:48:58,618

are there any guides to how to do

:

00:48:58,637 --> 00:48:59,057

Erika: Mm-hmm.

:

00:48:59,338 --> 00:49:01,318

Shari: And we kind of

came up e empty handed.

:

00:49:01,348 --> 00:49:06,178

There's tons of information out, out

there about how to retire to Mexico.

:

00:49:06,508 --> 00:49:10,708

, but there was not anything that

was targeting anyone who is younger

:

00:49:10,708 --> 00:49:15,148

and still working and might have a

young family or anything like that.

:

00:49:15,478 --> 00:49:19,958

So , over the years that we've been here,

we get questions all the time about how

:

00:49:19,958 --> 00:49:24,608

to do certain things, and nine times

outta 10, the person will say, oh my

:

00:49:24,608 --> 00:49:26,438

gosh, you know so much you should write a

:

00:49:26,712 --> 00:49:27,102

Erika: Yeah.

:

00:49:27,158 --> 00:49:29,678

Shari: And we were always

like, no, that's ridiculous.

:

00:49:29,678 --> 00:49:30,998

We're not gonna write a book.

:

00:49:31,058 --> 00:49:32,188

And then, , when was it?

:

00:49:32,188 --> 00:49:35,698

So we wrote this last year,

the beginning of last year.

:

00:49:35,698 --> 00:49:39,538

So, , early last year, I kind of

just woke up one morning and I had

:

00:49:39,568 --> 00:49:42,838

like the of the book in my head.

:

00:49:43,228 --> 00:49:47,608

. And so I knew that I wasn't gonna be able

to do anything until I got it outta my

:

00:49:47,762 --> 00:49:48,242

Erika: Yeah,

:

00:49:48,328 --> 00:49:51,298

Shari: So I just opened a

Google Doc and started typing.

:

00:49:52,108 --> 00:49:55,198

it was just kind of gonna be a little

like creative exercise, but the more

:

00:49:55,198 --> 00:49:56,758

I typed, the more into it I got.

:

00:49:57,238 --> 00:49:58,498

And then , the more into it I got.

:

00:49:58,498 --> 00:50:00,628

And then, I called Josh

over and I was like, Hey.

:

00:50:01,318 --> 00:50:02,518

What do you think about this?

:

00:50:02,518 --> 00:50:05,518

And you know, just kind of read him

what I had wrote and he was like,

:

00:50:06,288 --> 00:50:08,088

, yes, let's talk more about this.

:

00:50:08,418 --> 00:50:13,638

And we just started strategizing and

thinking about what could be included

:

00:50:13,638 --> 00:50:15,078

and what's useful to everyone.

:

00:50:15,078 --> 00:50:17,208

And that's how the book came about.

:

00:50:17,428 --> 00:50:22,048

So we collaborated on it and wrote like

a very, , thorough and straightforward

:

00:50:22,048 --> 00:50:26,818

and entertaining, if I do say so

myself, guide to Moving to Mexico.

:

00:50:26,848 --> 00:50:29,278

We have tons of stories to share.

:

00:50:29,638 --> 00:50:34,108

We have tons of friends who have had

crazy experiences as well, and we really

:

00:50:34,108 --> 00:50:35,758

like, don't hold back on anything.

:

00:50:35,792 --> 00:50:36,662

Erika: That's amazing.

:

00:50:37,082 --> 00:50:41,852

Do you find that as you're looking around,

you're seeing more and more young expats?

:

00:50:41,852 --> 00:50:42,557

Shari: A hundred percent.

:

00:50:42,557 --> 00:50:43,067

Yes.

:

00:50:43,427 --> 00:50:47,777

, when we first moved here, there

was a very small community of

:

00:50:47,777 --> 00:50:50,087

expats that were similar in age to

:

00:50:50,215 --> 00:50:50,505

Erika: Okay.

:

00:50:50,767 --> 00:50:53,167

, Shari: but ever since the

pandemic, it's just exploded.

:

00:50:53,350 --> 00:50:53,830

Erika: Okay.

:

00:50:54,007 --> 00:50:58,717

Shari: the ability for people to work

remotely has brought so many more people.

:

00:50:58,717 --> 00:51:00,547

I mean, all over the world for sure.

:

00:51:00,757 --> 00:51:04,717

But we're absolutely seeing it here

and it's such a cool opportunity for

:

00:51:04,717 --> 00:51:06,457

people to live in another country.

:

00:51:06,507 --> 00:51:09,597

, we have so many friends who

have moved here with young kids.

:

00:51:09,957 --> 00:51:15,177

We don't have kids ourselves, but an

amazing experience for kids to grow

:

00:51:15,177 --> 00:51:18,447

up in another culture, and especially

one where they're getting the

:

00:51:18,447 --> 00:51:23,607

opportunity to learn a language that

is not their, their native language.

:

00:51:23,667 --> 00:51:25,497

, and they pick it up so quickly.

:

00:51:25,497 --> 00:51:27,117

I'm incredibly jealous of them.

:

00:51:27,120 --> 00:51:27,360

Erika: So,

:

00:51:27,507 --> 00:51:28,437

Shari: But what a life skill.

:

00:51:28,830 --> 00:51:30,030

Erika: yeah, absolutely.

:

00:51:30,570 --> 00:51:36,210

So I think that, well, let me ask you,

let me rephrase this for people who feel

:

00:51:36,210 --> 00:51:41,520

that little voice that's saying, maybe

this might be for me, but I just feel

:

00:51:41,610 --> 00:51:44,400

scared and overwhelmed and intimidated.

:

00:51:44,600 --> 00:51:48,440

, other than reading your book, of

course, like is there like just one

:

00:51:48,440 --> 00:51:51,350

little piece of advice that you wish

you could just like whisper into

:

00:51:51,350 --> 00:51:52,730

anyone's ear who's going through that?

:

00:51:54,052 --> 00:51:55,757

Shari: Ooh, that's such a good question.

:

00:51:56,187 --> 00:51:59,427

, I think it kind of goes back to what

you said, which is kind of just like,

:

00:52:00,027 --> 00:52:02,787

just leap, you know, trust the universe.

:

00:52:03,057 --> 00:52:08,757

I think we humans, we are survivalists,

you know, we figure it out, we adapt.

:

00:52:09,027 --> 00:52:14,847

So situation you put yourself

in, gonna make it work or

:

00:52:15,147 --> 00:52:16,377

you're gonna rectify it, like.

:

00:52:16,707 --> 00:52:17,487

That's the other thing.

:

00:52:17,487 --> 00:52:21,357

We've known people, we've known lots

of people who have moved to Mexico,

:

00:52:21,627 --> 00:52:26,067

stayed for three months, six months,

a year, two years, decided it wasn't

:

00:52:26,067 --> 00:52:27,717

for them or it wasn't for them anymore.

:

00:52:28,107 --> 00:52:29,937

Moved back to their home country.

:

00:52:30,237 --> 00:52:34,167

So even if you, you do it and

decide it's not right for you,

:

00:52:34,167 --> 00:52:36,087

it's, you know, it's fixable.

:

00:52:36,087 --> 00:52:38,367

Like nothing is, nothing is the end of the

:

00:52:38,685 --> 00:52:39,585

Erika: Yeah, that's true.

:

00:52:39,585 --> 00:52:43,215

And it really makes me think of the

expression, like, it's better to regret

:

00:52:43,215 --> 00:52:45,165

doing something than not doing something.

:

00:52:45,975 --> 00:52:46,545

Um,

:

00:52:46,707 --> 00:52:47,217

Shari: agree.

:

00:52:47,295 --> 00:52:50,205

Erika: do you see yourselves living

here for the rest of your life?

:

00:52:51,687 --> 00:52:52,047

Shari: I have

:

00:52:52,210 --> 00:52:52,330

Erika: I,

:

00:52:52,647 --> 00:52:56,127

Shari: if there's one thing that I've

learned through the last, I don't know, 10

:

00:52:56,127 --> 00:53:00,567

years of our lives, I would say we are not

good at predicting what we're going to do.

:

00:53:01,305 --> 00:53:01,455

Erika: yeah.

:

00:53:01,857 --> 00:53:05,142

, Shari: but we are so happy in

Mexico we're, we really love it.

:

00:53:06,102 --> 00:53:09,522

, One of us for seas moving

back to the US anytime soon.

:

00:53:10,182 --> 00:53:13,122

Maybe when, maybe we'll

retire back in the us.

:

00:53:13,122 --> 00:53:13,632

I don't know.

:

00:53:13,710 --> 00:53:14,490

Erika: That would be hilarious.

:

00:53:14,562 --> 00:53:15,642

Shari: But we're super happy in

:

00:53:15,990 --> 00:53:16,500

Erika: Okay.

:

00:53:16,500 --> 00:53:17,310

That's amazing.

:

00:53:17,730 --> 00:53:21,810

. Okay, so let's talk about dogs,

because you are a dog person.

:

00:53:21,810 --> 00:53:22,920

You and Josh are dog people.

:

00:53:22,920 --> 00:53:23,910

I'm a dog person.

:

00:53:24,180 --> 00:53:27,540

I'm also the person that for

sure would get rabies, getting

:

00:53:27,540 --> 00:53:28,680

bit on a trip like I was.

:

00:53:28,965 --> 00:53:33,285

Justin Morocco, , in January, and

they're like, don't pet the dogs.

:

00:53:33,285 --> 00:53:34,845

And I'm like, I'm gonna pet the dogs.

:

00:53:34,995 --> 00:53:38,565

, and for like 24 hours I was like, okay,

I'm gonna let this dog come say hello

:

00:53:38,565 --> 00:53:40,305

to me, but I'm not gonna pet this dog.

:

00:53:40,365 --> 00:53:42,105

And then immediately I

was like, I don't care.

:

00:53:42,135 --> 00:53:46,355

Like if this is how I dive and it's just

my time, , because I just love dogs.

:

00:53:46,415 --> 00:53:49,075

So, , tell me about your

experience with dogs in Mexico.

:

00:53:50,932 --> 00:53:52,882

Shari: We, well, we had two dogs.

:

00:53:52,882 --> 00:53:54,952

We lost one, , at the end of the last

:

00:53:55,015 --> 00:53:55,405

Erika: Oh, I'm.

:

00:53:55,612 --> 00:53:57,532

Shari: but both of them are from here.

:

00:53:57,532 --> 00:53:58,102

Thank you.

:

00:53:58,482 --> 00:53:59,832

, so both of them are from here.

:

00:53:59,832 --> 00:54:06,622

We, , I feel like is a very dog friendly

place, like a dog friendly culture.

:

00:54:06,922 --> 00:54:12,322

, a lot of, a lot of people consider

dogs part of their families as, as

:

00:54:12,322 --> 00:54:14,002

I certainly do, and I know you do.

:

00:54:14,572 --> 00:54:18,682

And, , actually there's a funny

saying in Spanish, which is, , the

:

00:54:18,682 --> 00:54:23,332

word for dog is, and I can't roll

my Rs so forgive my terrible accent,

:

00:54:23,332 --> 00:54:25,112

but, , the word for dog is peril.

:

00:54:25,472 --> 00:54:27,392

And the word for child is eho.

:

00:54:27,782 --> 00:54:29,402

And they've combined those words.

:

00:54:29,402 --> 00:54:32,972

So for someone who has dogs

and not children, they call

:

00:54:32,972 --> 00:54:33,992

the dogs their per hos,

:

00:54:34,570 --> 00:54:35,465

Erika: Oh my gosh.

:

00:54:35,972 --> 00:54:36,362

Shari: very

:

00:54:36,545 --> 00:54:38,135

Erika: That's way better than kids.

:

00:54:38,135 --> 00:54:38,945

That's awesome.

:

00:54:40,295 --> 00:54:40,715

I love that.

:

00:54:41,927 --> 00:54:45,197

Shari: But yeah, I, the, the

dogs are very welcome here and

:

00:54:45,197 --> 00:54:46,847

where, where we happen to live.

:

00:54:46,847 --> 00:54:52,467

Our experience, , has been that there's

this, this sweet slash aggravating culture

:

00:54:52,707 --> 00:54:55,597

where, , dogs are kind of called free

:

00:54:55,720 --> 00:54:56,140

Erika: Mm-hmm.

:

00:54:56,587 --> 00:55:01,587

Shari: And a lot of people consider

the dogs to, , have their own lives

:

00:55:01,587 --> 00:55:09,477

and motivations and, and wishes, and

therefore they shouldn't be regulated to

:

00:55:09,507 --> 00:55:11,547

whatever your schedule is for the day.

:

00:55:11,727 --> 00:55:16,437

So they sort of have free reign of,

of their, their life during the day,

:

00:55:16,437 --> 00:55:21,267

and they can just sort of roam the

streets, go, you know, find some food

:

00:55:21,267 --> 00:55:25,197

at a restaurant by, you know, begging

off the tourists or go hang out on

:

00:55:25,197 --> 00:55:26,547

the beach, go meet their friends.

:

00:55:26,997 --> 00:55:31,377

And it's, I, the aggravating part is just

because then no one's picking up the poop.

:

00:55:31,407 --> 00:55:32,727

So that, that kind of sucks.

:

00:55:32,865 --> 00:55:33,435

Erika: That makes sense.

:

00:55:33,447 --> 00:55:34,257

Shari: always have to be.

:

00:55:35,082 --> 00:55:36,042

the lookout when you're walking

:

00:55:36,255 --> 00:55:36,545

Erika: Yeah.

:

00:55:37,032 --> 00:55:40,422

Shari: but the rest of it is super

sweet and it, it's funny because you

:

00:55:40,782 --> 00:55:46,602

legit do see dogs kind of running

down the sidewalk before sunset and

:

00:55:46,602 --> 00:55:49,362

you're like, oh, like they know that

they have to get to the beach to meet

:

00:55:49,362 --> 00:55:50,982

their buddies in time for sunset.

:

00:55:51,222 --> 00:55:52,212

'cause that's when everyone's

:

00:55:52,500 --> 00:55:52,950

Erika: That's so cute.

:

00:55:53,052 --> 00:55:53,892

Shari: and it's a very cute

:

00:55:54,555 --> 00:55:58,095

Erika: Oh, that is one of my favorite

things about Latin and South American

:

00:55:58,095 --> 00:56:02,595

culture is, uh, at first you see dogs

on the street and as an American you're

:

00:56:02,595 --> 00:56:04,425

like, oh my God, these dogs must be saved.

:

00:56:04,425 --> 00:56:06,975

And then you quickly realize,

oh, these dogs are doing great.

:

00:56:06,975 --> 00:56:08,295

They literally have their own lives.

:

00:56:08,505 --> 00:56:09,705

They have their little friends.

:

00:56:09,885 --> 00:56:12,975

They know exactly which restaurants

are giving them scraps when, and

:

00:56:12,975 --> 00:56:15,135

they're pretty well taken care of.

:

00:56:15,405 --> 00:56:20,985

Um, so for somebody who is an American

who has pets and is thinking of moving

:

00:56:20,985 --> 00:56:25,905

to Mexico, is there a quarantine period

or is it a pretty easy transition

:

00:56:25,905 --> 00:56:27,255

to just bring your pets with you?

:

00:56:28,557 --> 00:56:31,767

Shari: There is not a quarantine

and it is a pretty easy transition.

:

00:56:32,067 --> 00:56:36,117

, basically there's , there's a

couple rules that you have to

:

00:56:36,117 --> 00:56:37,677

follow when you import a pet.

:

00:56:37,727 --> 00:56:40,067

, but it's nothing hard.

:

00:56:40,457 --> 00:56:43,757

And the main thing is basically just

to make sure they've got all their

:

00:56:43,757 --> 00:56:48,647

immunizations and that you have, , a

note from a veterinarian stating that,

:

00:56:48,650 --> 00:56:49,100

Erika: Okay.

:

00:56:49,550 --> 00:56:50,030

Easy.

:

00:56:50,660 --> 00:56:51,110

That's awesome.

:

00:56:51,137 --> 00:56:51,677

Shari: yes.

:

00:56:51,950 --> 00:56:52,580

Erika: Okay.

:

00:56:52,670 --> 00:56:53,360

Okay.

:

00:56:53,660 --> 00:56:57,350

, Shari: I'm, my main thing is like

if you are Mexico curious, like

:

00:56:57,350 --> 00:57:02,150

it's a really amazing country and

I encourage anyone who's thinking

:

00:57:02,150 --> 00:57:04,280

about it to just kind of dig into it.

:

00:57:04,280 --> 00:57:07,580

Whether that's reading our book

or just reading blog posts,

:

00:57:07,580 --> 00:57:08,750

digging around on the internet.

:

00:57:08,750 --> 00:57:12,740

There's so much information out

there and it's just such an amazing

:

00:57:12,740 --> 00:57:14,090

experience for us to live in

:

00:57:14,379 --> 00:57:19,359

Erika: Yeah, I'm so glad to know you and

to be able to share your story because

:

00:57:19,359 --> 00:57:23,229

I think that it's just so inspiring

and like we've mentioned a couple times

:

00:57:23,229 --> 00:57:26,459

already, I think this is something a

lot of people are curious about, but

:

00:57:26,459 --> 00:57:28,739

it's really easy to stay comfortable.

:

00:57:28,939 --> 00:57:33,019

, so it's just so cool and inspiring

to see people who are scared and do

:

00:57:33,019 --> 00:57:36,589

it anyways and then are absolutely

rewarded for making a bold choice.

:

00:57:36,889 --> 00:57:39,739

, I think everybody needs to find their

version of that, whatever it is.

:

00:57:39,959 --> 00:57:44,189

, I will, I will link your book in

the show notes , and then, , yeah.

:

00:57:44,549 --> 00:57:46,379

Thank you so much for your time, Sherry.

:

00:57:46,609 --> 00:57:48,559

Thank you so much for listening today.

:

00:57:48,589 --> 00:57:53,089

Like I mentioned, I will link the Young

expats guide to Mexico in my show notes.

:

00:57:53,389 --> 00:57:58,129

And as always, Clover Club listeners

get 10% off@hawkinsonclover.com

:

00:57:58,309 --> 00:58:00,859

with promo code, Clover Club, all caps.

:

00:58:01,129 --> 00:58:05,299

And Sherry, thank you Xtend, my

gratitude to Josh as well for

:

00:58:05,419 --> 00:58:07,999

just creating the story with

you and allowing us to share it.

:

00:58:08,209 --> 00:58:09,879

And, , yeah, everyone get out there.

:

00:58:09,879 --> 00:58:11,289

Be brave and do something cool.

:

00:58:12,185 --> 00:58:12,765

Shari: Yes, be

:

00:58:12,969 --> 00:58:13,389

Erika: Yes.

:

00:58:13,565 --> 00:58:13,845

Shari: Erica.

:

00:58:13,899 --> 00:58:15,129

Erika: Thank you Sherry.

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About the Podcast

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Clover Club
Curious conversations and stories intended to make you laugh and learn.

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About your host

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Erika Audrey

Erika Audrey, a luminous presence hailing from the vibrant city of Atlanta, Georgia, is not your ordinary hairstylist and boutique owner. With a zest for life that's as contagious as her laughter, Erika is poised to take the podcasting world by storm as she embarks on her latest venture.

Launching her debut podcast is a natural extension of Erika's multifaceted personality. With an uncanny ability to seamlessly weave humor into her conversations, Erika's laughter-inducing anecdotes and razor-sharp wit are bound to captivate listeners. Her intelligence shines through as she tackles a diverse range of topics, proving that beneath the laughter lies substance and insight.